Q1 您提出过“非建筑”“非景观”“非规划”等设计理念，从城市设计的角度，该如何解读这些理念？

就我的理解而言，应该说这并不是一种设计理念，而只是一个思考角度。这是多年前偶然谈到的，也并不是要否定以前传统的建筑、规划与景观体系，而是从一个非传统、非学院派的角度去思考我们所面临的建筑、规划和景观问题。我觉得这样理解可能相对更准确一些。

传统学科当中的科学性与规律性对我们做任何事来说都是非常重要的基石，我们还是要遵循它们给我们提供的科学方法和观察事物的路径，这些都是我们从传统的体系当中所获得的。作为一个建筑师，我所理解的规划很大程度上是与行政体系及其运作相关的，传统规划学科的理论和体系构建方式与现行的体系之间有很好的契合度。但不可否认的是，它可能会有一些忽略掉的地方。比如，我们传统的规划很注重建设用地，但对非建设用地或者说对包括了生态、循环等人类全部生存环境的总体性思考相对还比较欠缺。因此，不仅需要从“非规划”的角度来看，还要纳入大景观的观念中看，这样，我们可以把景观理解为更大的层面，它的体系可能更为宏大，而不仅是我们说的花草田林。建筑也是一样，我们除了建筑创作以外，很大程度上是根据建筑的行政审批和建设流程来构建整个学科体系的，学科体系直接应对怎么设计房子、盖房子，怎么验收。所以，我们现在不仅需要打通景观和规划之间学科和眼界的关系，还有它们与建筑与人之间的关系。

建筑师现在很关注城市设计、很关注景观和规划的层面，是因为我们在思考房子的时候，它已经不仅仅是房子了，我们越来越认识到房子和景观之间、和规划之间并非割裂关系。规划有时间的纵深感，景观有空间的开阔感，而建筑与空间在其中起到的是连接和纽带的作用，因为建筑是比较引人注目的实体，是实施的重要落实者。那么问题就是，作为整个规划思考的时间长河中的一环，建筑在其中有没有起到一个合适的作用，在整个大景观空间中，建筑是不是担任了一个恰当的角色。建筑不仅仅是房子本身，它是对整个大层面空间的，也是对于整个城市、整个人工环境的具体表达，一个长久的历史时期也包括对于未来的思考。从这个意义上讲，建筑、规划和景观应该是一体的，这种一体不是指它们的技术细节或学科设置，而是从观念、理念和眼界上，应该打通它们之间的关系。

所以说“非景观”“非建筑”“非规划”并不是一个特别科学的提法，它只是提供给大家一个思考问题的角度，建筑之外的思考是什么，景观之外的思考是什么，规划之外的思考是什么，这才是比较重要的。城市设计恰好处在这几个思考之间。如果说我们现在有一碗汤，里面有各种食材，这个汤恰好就是城市设计，它可以融合各种学科，而且城市设计并不是法定规划，也不是像建筑施工图一样的工程图纸，它是一项探索性的、研究性的内容，它可以有很多的面目和形式。这个是我们多年做城市设计很重要的一个体会。

图1 / Figure 1 2017年9月17日，刘刚副总建筑师在中国建筑西南设计研究院有限公司接受采访 Mr. LIU Gang in Interview, September 17, 2017, China Southwest Architectural Design and Research Institute Corp., LTD., Chengdu, China

来源：贾园 摄 Source: Photo by JIA Yuan

城市设计法无定法，你很难说城市设计一定是什么样子的，所以我们看到规划专业的做得像规划设计，建筑专业的做得像建筑群设计，我们也可能做出来既不像规划也不像建筑，而是融合了两者的特点。有的城市设计做得很专一，只探讨其中的一个问题。我们曾经在都江堰做一个项目，就只探讨建筑与山体之间的高度问题，是用GIS分析的方法来做的，很多人觉得这件事情不可思议，一个城市设计就只响应一个问题，好像我们没有做完。但有时候我们的城市设计就做得很全，比如我们和东南大学寒冬青老师的团队合作的都江堰总体城市设计，这个就很全面，各方面的问题都在探讨。所以，我们很难去规定城市设计到底应该怎么做，或者说用什么观念来做。这个还是大家目前在探讨的问题，有人说城市设计应该规范一下 ，现在做得太乱了，至少从市场层面上来讲不好管理。怎么收费，怎么统一标准？决策者拿到城市设计后怎么判断它是不是一个合格的产品呢？大家都觉得很困扰。但从另一个方面讲，如果把城市设计规定死了，它还能不能解决问题呢？如果把城市设计法定化，那和既有的法定规划的关系是重叠、补充、还是替代？这个问题说不清楚，就不应该规定得那么死。我个人觉得城市设计还是应该自由一点，发挥它研究和探索的功能，我们目前的法定体系已经涵盖得比较全面了，从法理上来说没有太大必要再做一个法定的东西。我们恰恰需要补充法定规划的缺失、拓展研究的角度。所以说回来，“非建筑”“非景观”“非规划”是对传统的建筑、景观、规划的充实和融合，是从不同学科的边缘来回望我们这个学科，探索可以从哪些角度来重新看待这个事情，看待我们学科研究的范畴。从这个角度来讲，城市设计是一个很好的载体。

现在的年轻一代被称为互联网时代的原住民，同时也成长于机动车交通繁荣的时代，他们的生活方式构建在互联网交往和机动车流动这两个巨大的基础之上，这给城市空间带来完全不同的理解。所以不用对我们传统城市尺度的改变反应过度，这在很大程度上是时代发展的印记，因为人们生活状态已经有了很大的改变。我们现在需要的是把传统的、有价值的东西保留下来，而不是把新的东西也要完全建成传统的。城市、环境、建筑都会展现时代的特征，设计师需要理解生活，特别是年轻人的生活状态，考虑人性化，从人的需求出发，而不是只从设计本身出发。我们刚才所讲的核心问题就是人性化，我们要研究大家为什么要用这个东西，大家是怎么用的，这个很重要。旧城保护更重要的是加入新的体验让其更有生命力，新区建设则需要研究人的活动和未来的发展。这两种公共空间在成都是有很多的，也代表着成都这座城市多年发展的一个渐变过程，这是很有意思的一点。有时候我的朋友过来，我就会带他们到太古里那边看一眼，然后开车沿着天府大道一路走下去，特别简单的一条路，但是基本可以概括成都这几十年的变迁。成都的城市空间总体还是比较宜人的，城市尺度也有时空的变化，总的来说还是个能呼吸的城市。

我其实是重庆人，但来成都的时间已经比在重庆的时间长得多了，所以也可以说我是成都人。大部分人对成都的理解都是这个城市比较轻松，有很多美食和美景，整个城市是比较慵懒、松散自由的感觉。但我想说成都最大的特色是它的包容性。成都是我所见过的城市当中包容性最强的一个，外地人在这里丝毫体会不到所谓的地域歧视和文化偏见，这是我认为成都特别好的地方。包容所带来的结果就是巨大的开放性，思维活跃、不惧创新，这是成都持续保持活力的内在特质。成都从本质上来讲是一个移民城市，有大量外来人口，人口来源的多样性形成了文化的多元和思维的碰撞，这样的文化特征是现代城市宝贵的资源。成都这个城市也确实比较慵懒，因为它的地理环境太好了。从2,000多年前李冰建都江堰开始，成都平原就没有水害了，也成为秦国当时最大的粮仓，所以秦国才有实力统一六国，这一片区域就成为无忧无虑的天府之国。所以从整个地域性格上来讲，它不太担忧未来的事情，也比较愿意去享受生活。成都这个城市一直比较从容，这样的宽容和从容对于城市而言也极其宝贵，让人们的生活多样，而且勇于尝试。

其实以前成都没有太多的公共空间，市民大部分活动在自己居住区的院坝里，或者就在街边上，以前的公共活动就是街边打打麻将、茶馆里喝喝茶。成都的发展也是城市逐渐公共化的过程，成为了一个向公众开放的、现代化的、有国际范儿的城市，这是在改革开放后，尤其是最近十几年的发展集中体现出来的。我们现在所看到的成都的公共空间主要有两部分：一部分是传统的街巷，比如少城、玉林那一片的街巷，还有北半城那儿的一些机关大院，这些地方还保留着成都老的韵味，是一些传统的公共活动场所；还有一部分就是具有现代气息的公共活动和商业文化空间，比如我们从老街巷当中整理出来的宽窄巷子、东郊工业遗产改建的创意社区，周边新建了许多大型文化设施的天府广场，还有新城区里面做了很多规模很大的沿江环湖的公园，茶余饭后大家都愿意在公园中跑步、骑车。现在大家的生活方式发生了变化，城市也变得更加开放，更具有公共性。一个城市的发展是商业、文化、生活相互交织在一起的，这些活动有的会发生在一些传统的领域，新的空间出现的时候会承载一些新的活动。生活的需求让我们做出一些公共空间，同时由于我们的公共空间做出了新的形式，它也会塑造人们的生活方式。

比如以前我们讲大家喜欢逛街，喜欢一些尺度很好的街道，但是你会发现现在的年轻人不太有像老一辈那样的逛街方式，他们往往会在特定的区域或者室内综合体里面有目的性地做一件事情，这就是互联网时代对城市空间提出的不一样的需求。我们以前去逛街的乐趣在于有大量未知和偶然的活动，现在我们在出行前就会在手机上查哪些地方好玩、哪些东西好吃，会把行程定下来之后再按照规划的路线去。现代的这种方式偶然性会跟以前有很大的不同，这就要求我们现在的空间更加注重特色的强化，在我们的空间与活动之间建立更强的关联，能够吸引大家参与进来并且可以容纳那些期望的活动。这跟以前我们把一溜店铺线性排过去之后，大家自己逛的时候慢慢发现喜欢的店的状态不一样，人们的生活状态已经发生了变化。

同时，我们的出行方式也发生了变化。虽然我们经常强调步行，但不能片面地让整个城市都步行，这就没有效率了，它应该是指人在到达目的地之后，还有一定的愿望再逛一下。我们总是在说要做一定的空间让大家步行，我就在想为什么要让大家步行，为什么要让大家去逛而不是坐在那里，一定是要有合适的东西吸引大家去逛。所以，我们不能本末倒置，一个步行城市之所以会产生亲切感，是因为步行所带来的交流和互动，这带给我们很好的体验，而不只是目的性地购物。促进人与物、人与空间、人与人之间的交流和对话才是步行的目的，但步行本身并不是目的，它只是一个手段、一种方式。从这一点上来讲，步行空间一定是限制在步行的舒适尺度之内的。

Q2 成都是一座特色鲜明的城市，能否请您谈谈对成都城市特色的理解以及成都的公共空间？

Q3 您刚才提到了成都的天府大道，这也是成都的中轴线，请您谈谈对这条轴线的看法。

在中国城市当中，我好像没看见其他城市有成都这样的中轴线的，这种方式以前有，其他城市也有，但是没这么长，没这么重要。印象中好像只有迪拜的谢赫扎耶德路，从迪拜一直到阿布扎比，整个迪拜沿着那条路来发展，但好像都没有成都的这条中轴线那么有仪式感。这条轴线对成都的影响非常大，无论从精神层面还是从文化和公共空间形成的层面。成都的老城区叫作“三城相套”，轴线贯穿中间的皇城，旁边是少城和大城，同时成都近几十年新的发展部分也几乎都在这条中轴线上。我们现在说到成都就会意识到，这条轴线串联了太多的东西，成都这个城市发展的一个最强烈的基因就是这条轴线，串联了重要的、标志性的公共空间以及著名的历史文化场所。从火车北站最重要的交通枢纽开始，一直到天府广场周边重要的公共文化建筑群，朝南走是各种商务商业聚集区，再往下是高新区和天府新区，CBD、政府机关也都在这条轴线上。天府新区的规划建设模式和老城区有很大的不同，但在本质上还是沿这条主轴线发展的延续。所以说，成都本质上是一个城市核心沿轴线线性逐次展开的城市，这个生长的基因非常独特。

成都能够沿着这条轴线发展可能也是有一个心理上的认知，成都被两山夹在一起，一边是龙门山，一边是龙泉山，成都平原是夹在中间的一个纵向盆地，所以好像成都只能南北向地发展。这个认识逐渐形成，是有地理和历史的原因，而且对城市来讲，轴线式的发展也有一个很大的便利性，就是城市的基础设施空间展开和城市叙事的描述都会比较简便。所有的特色空间、形象标识就挂在这条线上，大家对这个城市的认知也特别简便明了。我们很难去讲它有什么好处或者坏处，但它是这个城市最重要的一个特征。

现在也有一个重要的变化，成都现在的行政范围扩展到了龙泉山以东空港新城的巨大区域，这样龙泉山就从城市的边缘变成了夹在城市中间的生态区域，城市的格局有可能发生巨大的转变，那么城市发展的路径也可能会改变，这是值得去认真思考和期待的。

Q4 锦江是成都的母亲河，您刚才在谈成都的公共空间时也提到了沿着锦江做的公园，如何看待这些滨水空间呢？

锦江是成都平原灌溉用的主要河流，最近提到的“天府绿道”实际上就是沿锦江的三百里生态带，从都江堰蜿蜒东南，以两江环抱老城，再一路向南直到黄龙溪古镇。锦江既是成都千年发展的血脉，也是历史文化的纽带。

成都跟很多城市一样，因为水位不是很稳定，水网也不像苏州那样密集，亲水性并不太好。所以更重要的是它两岸的滨水空间，这样的带状空间是容纳公共生活的载体，也能很好地连接城市功能和生态景观。1998年治理府南河的项目还得到了联合国人居奖，改变了河道两侧脏乱的环境，做了一些生态示范项目如活水公园。做了这样一些项目之后，城市的滨水空间干净整洁了很多，但是也有问题，有很多的滨水空间边上在当时规划的是住宅用地，这就造成了有很长一段时间滨水空间的公共性不足，没有把滨水区域和公共活动更多地联系在一起。这是后来引起反思的地方，现在逐渐在改善，让整个府河、南河周边的这些区域更有公共性，让大家能够参与进去。

这期间做了很多小公园、绿道之类的，其实人们都喜欢在水边聚集，城市水岸空间对大家来说极其重要。当然对这个空间的认知也不断有变化，随着时代的发展，大家对它的利用方式不同了，年轻人和老年人的生活也不太一样。所以还是像前面我们说的，还是要看大家的生活是怎么样的，空间和场所的体验会和以前有所不同。我们说这些滨水空间要成体系、要连通，这是基于一个比较重要的认知，滨水空间不仅仅是休闲的景观场所，而且是城市公共生活的载体，生活与交往的空间，城市活力的画卷。

Q5 那您觉得成都居民的生活方式有什么特点吗？

其实我觉得中国人都差不多，大家聊天、吃饭，然后喝茶、打麻将，可能都差不多。只不过成都人打麻将比较出名，好像觉得全城都在打麻将，其实也不是那么回事，尤其现在年轻人很少打，可能会失传了（笑）。这些年生活场景日新月异，变化很大，互联网和电子设备带来的生活变化，对人们的影响真的比以前迅猛。就像前面说的基于互联网交流和现代交通移动这两个基础，现在的生活状态和以前有了很大的改变，但成都所独有的闲适的生活氛围，漫不经心的生活态度还是传承了下来。这是成都人最大的特色，奋斗打拼的同时还能保持乐观豁达的心态。

除了质量评估机构的缺失外，在评估手段和评估工具上，也欠缺科学性，评估的方式通常只定性，不定量，评估的主要对象也仅仅是内部审计的结果报告。这种只看结果报告的评估是没有意义的，因为很多情况下审计机构会在审计的过程中出现问题，在审计的方式方法上出现弊病，这些是仅凭一张结果报告单无法评估出来的。

Q6 您谈到成都是一个包容性很强的城市，外来人口对成都的城市发展、传统特色有什么影响呢？

影响绝对是正面的，一个城市欣欣向荣需要的最重要的条件，就是它能够吸引到新鲜血液，只要能够吸引到，说明这个城市在正向地发展，如果吸引到的都是年轻人，我觉得这个城市真的是前途无量。新的人口进来，必然带来思想的碰撞以及交流扩展，而且外来移民特有的开创精神也会促进整个城市教育、文化和商业的升级和发展。城市的文化是鲜活的有机体而不是固化的标本，外来人口所带来的文化和意识都会让城市文明更加丰满。像成都这样宽容的本土文化，更是促进交流交融的沃土，所以成都虽然是内陆城市，也会以包容和开放闻名，也会持续地进步和发展。

成都作为第一批历史文化名城，物质遗存的数量比其他历史名城少很多，质量也不高，但是成都两千年城址未变，城名未变，整个城市中心也没变过，这种传承可能是成都当时入选的一个很重要的原因，而且这种传承更多的是格局和意识上的。历史上成都平原经历了很多次的大清洗和大规模移民，成都的历史不像有的城市有那么强烈的主线，也就不像罗马和西安有那么厚重的一个历史感背负。大家对成都的理解也特别宽容，成都文化有很大一部分跟市井文化、市井生活是紧密相连的，既不像北京基于皇族贵族的历史积淀，也不会有西安那样的大唐情节和正统观。成都留下来的宽窄巷子、少城现在都变成了市井文化的一部分，都是跟生活在一起。

所以成都既有历史格局和文化意识的传承，也同时兼具移民城市的包容力和活力，如果说有什么需要固守的话，那就是这种从容的生活状态、宽厚的人文气质，这才是成都文化的本质。所以成都对历史遗存的保留和传承跟其他的都城不一样，它没那么多厚重感，更多的是轻松和睦的感觉。

Q7 能否请您列举一例成都最具特色的公共场所？

这个比较多，如果举一例的话不好说，但可以举两个对照的例子。

一个是IFS和太古里片区，那片是很有意思的，它是一个传统的区域，有大慈寺和传统商业街区春熙路，同时又融合了现代的东西。可以看到成都如何在一个传统的地方构建现代化的城市商业街区。在大慈寺这样的文保单位周边做现代商业开发，这在全国也是非常罕见的。以前面对这种地方的项目，大家都很紧张，慎之又慎，很容易做出来全都是完全仿古的。太古里是一个很好的范例，实际上很多学者都觉得这样是对的，你不能做一个假古董在旁边，不能像有的古城，以高超的仿古做旧工艺让专业建筑师都难分真假，那样反而冲淡了历史遗存的价值。在保持格局和肌理延续的同时，新旧区分最好能够让我一眼看出来，这样才会在历史片区融入时代的气质，让老城区的更新更具有生活的内容。

The impact is definitely positive. The most important condition for a city to thriving is its ability to attract fresh blood. As long as it has the ability to attract, it indicates that the city is progressing positively; and if it has the ability to attract young people, I think the city owns a brightfurther. The arrival of new populations will surely bring the collision of different ideas and the expansion of exchanges. Moreover, the unique pioneering spirit of immigrants will also promote the upgrading and development of education, culture and commerce in the entire city. Urban culture is a living organism rather than a solidified specimen, so the culture and consciousness brought by the migrant population will make urban civilization more full. Such as the tolerant local culture of Chengdu, it’s more suitable to be the fertile ground for promoting exchange.Although Chengdu is an inland city, it will be known for its tolerance and opening up, and it will also continue to progress and development.

I actually from Chongqing, but the time in Chengdu is much longer than in Chongqing, so I can say that I am Chengdu. Most people think that the life in Chengdu is relatively easy, with a lot of tasty and beauty.And the whole city is lazy and free. But I want to say Chengdu’s biggest feature is its inclusiveness. Chengdu is one of the most inclusive among the cities I have ever seen. The foreigners can’t feel the so-called geographical discrimination or cultural prejudice, which is a particularly good place for me to think of Chengdu.The result of tolerance is its enormous openness, active thinking and innovation, which is the intrinsic quality of Chengdu’s continued vitality. Chengdu is an immigrant citywith a large number of immigrants. The diversity of population sources has shaped the cultural pluralism and the collision of thinking. Such cultural characteristics are precious resources of modern cities. Chengdu city is indeed lazy, because of its geographical environment is great. Since more than 2000 years ago, when Li Bing started construction of Dujiangyan, there was no water damage in the Chengdu Plain and it became the largest granary in the Qin Dynasty. Therefore, Qin had the power to unify the six countries. This area becomes a carefree land of abundance. So from the overall geographical character, it is not too worried about the future, and has more willing to enjoy life.Therefore, the city of Chengdu has beencalm, such tolerance and ease for the city is also extremely valuable, so that people’s lives varied, and are willing to try.

FULL TEXTS TRANSLATED FROM CHINESE

[U-TALK]

2.3.2治理原理利用植物自身的固土保水作用达到集中汇流“减能”的目的，控制侵蚀沟的发展，同时保证排水功能。在侵蚀沟沟头采取柳跌水做沟头防护，在沟底布设柳编谷坊或密植沙棘；在沟头或沟道内水位落差较大的情况下，可采用多级跌水的形式进行消能。

说起来最贵的可以用来作表壳的金属莫过于铂金。国内有位收藏家说过，见到铂金表就买，原因就是生产铂金表壳表是很少的，有就是罕见的特别款。比如百达翡丽的月相计时万年历2499就是非常罕见的，百达翡丽从1951年开始制造复杂款，持续35年共生产了337枚黄金表壳、10枚玫瑰金，而铂金表壳只做过2枚。铂金壳腕表是很珍贵，公价上比金的要贵很多。铂是地球地壳中最罕见的元素之一，主要分布在南非，当地铂产量占全球的80%。铂的年产量只有几百吨（黄金为2000-3000吨 ），是一种非常贵重的物质和主要的贵金属贸易商品。但是相比铂，手表材质上还有更加昂贵的材质使用。

Generally in Chinese cities, It seemed that I haven’t seen such a central axis of Chengdu. This citystructure has been existed in history, also in other cities,but none of them has been so long or so important.The impression coming to me seems to be only the Sheikh Zayed Road in Dubai, from Dubai to Abu Dhabi, along which the entire Dubai development.But it seems that there is no such sense of the ceremony of the central axis as Chengdu. The impact of this axis in Chengdu is really significant, both from the spiritual level and from the level of connecting culture and public space. The old city structure of Chengdu is called “NestedThree Cities”. It means that the main axis runs through the middle of the Imperial City, the Small cities and the Great Cityis next to the main axis. At the same time, almost all of Chengdu’s new developments in recent decades are concentratedaround this axis. As we are mentioning Chengduthese days, we will realize that this axis has connected too many “things” in series.This axis has becoming one of the strongest genes in the city’s development in Chengdu, connecting important public spaces and landmarks of famous historical and cultural places. From the most important transportation hub of North Railway Station,to themain public cultural buildings around Tianfu Square, and moving southward there is a variety of commercial and commercial gathering areas. Still moving southward the High-tech Zone and Tianfu New Zone is CBD and government agencies next to the accumulation area, those main part of the Chengdu city are all on this axis. The planning and construction mode of Tianfu New District is quite different from that of the old city, but it is essentially a continuation of the development along this main axis. So, in essence, Chengdu is a city which the core of the city expands linearly along the axis.The gene of its growth is very unique.

[Date]September 17, 2017

《中华人民共和国立法法》规定，有关犯罪和刑罚的事项只能制定法律。制定一部社区矫正法规范我国的社区矫正工作是必然趋势，但笔者认为这部法律的制定不应操之过急。我国的社区矫正立法应采取“先下后上”的模式，由各地方制定各自省份的社区矫正实施细则，经过充分实践、积累经验后，由国家立法机关作出全面的调研，充分考虑分析我国的总体情况和不同地区的地域性后再制定一部完备的社区矫正法。

[Place]Chengdu, China

[Interviewer]JIA Yuan, FAN Ruobin

[Translator]JIA Yuan, FAN Ruobin (from Chinese to English)

Liu Gang, professor of senior architect, vice chief architect of CSWADI (China Southwest Architectural Design and Research Institute CORP. LTD), director and chief architect of CDUDC (ChengDu Urban Design Research Center), standing director of Urban Design Branch,Architectural Society of China, member of Urban Design Branch, Urban Planning Society of China, senior member of Architectural Society of China, winner of the 9th Chinese Young Architect Award by Architectural Society of China.

He focuses on the design and research of urban design,and has directed more than one hundred projects which covers general/regional/block urban design involving spatial development plan, new area construction, urban regeneration, industrial park planning, post-disaster reconstruction, ecological conservation, historical and cultural protection & inheritance, etc, a lot of which have won ministerial and provincial-Level awards.

Source: Provided by Mr. LIU Gang.

Q1 You’ve proposed the“non-architecture”“non-landscape”“non-planning”design concepts, from the perspective of urban design, how to interpret these ideas?

In my understanding, this is not a design concept.It’s only a way of thinking. It was mentioned by chance many years ago and it did not mean to negate the traditional architecture, planning and landscape systems of the past. Instead, we considered the architecture, planning and landscape issues from a non-traditional and non-academic perspective. I think this understanding may be relatively more accurate.

The science and regularity of the traditional disciplines are very important cornerstones for anything we do. We should follow the traditional scientific methods and the path of observing things. As an architect, I think the planning largely related to the administrative system and its operation. There is a good agreement between the construction of traditional planning theory and the current planning system.But it is undeniable that it may have some overlooked place.For example, our traditional planning places a lot of emphasis on land for construction purposes, but it lacks a general consideration of the problems of non-construction land, or of the entire living environment including ecology and circulation.Therefore, not only from the perspective of “non-planning”, but also into the concept of“grand landscape”, so that we can understand the landscape as a larger dimension and its system may be more ambitious, not only the flowers or the forest. The same is true for architecture. In addition to architectural creations, we build the system of discipline largely based on the administrative approval and construction process of a building. The disciplinary system responds directly to how to design a house, build a house and accept a house. So now we need not only to open up the interdisciplinary relations between landscape and planning, but also their relationship with architecture and people.

Architects are now focusing on urban design and are concerned with the landscape and planning.Because it is more than just a house when we think about the architecture. We are increasingly realizing that there are some links between the architecture and the landscape and the planning.Planning has attributes of time, landscape has attributes of space, and architecture play the role of linkages,because the building is more compelling entities.The problem is that, the architecture, as a part of planning, whether plays a proper role from the point of planning and landscape. Architecture is not just a house itself.It is a concrete expression of the entire large-scale space. It is also a part of the whole city and the entire artificial environment.It is a part of thinking about long historical period and the future. In this sense, architecture, planning and landscape should be integrated. It doesn’t refer to their technical details or subject settings, but rather should establish the relationship between them in terms of concepts.

Therefore, “non-landscape”, “non-architectural”and “non-planning” is not ascientific idea.They only provide us with a perspective for thinking: is there anything beyond the architecture, the landscape, “the planning? This is more important.Urban design happens to be between these thoughts. If we now have a bowl of soup, which has a variety of ingredients, this soup is exactly urban design,it can integrate a variety of disciplines, and urban design is not a statutory plan, nor is it the same as the construction drawings.It is an exploratory and researching discipline and it can have many forms.This is an important experience we have made in urban design for many years.

Urban Design has no standards. It is hard to say that urban design must be look like something.So we see that the planning does it as planning design,architecture does it as architecture design,or we may also be made to neither planning nor unlike architecture, it combines the characteristics of both. Some urban design is very specific, only to explore one of the problems. We have done a project in Dujiangyan, only to explore the height of the problem between the building and the mountain, with the method of GIS analysis. Many people think it incredible, anurban design just solveone problem, as if we did not finish.But sometimes our urban design is very complete. For example,the general urban design of Dujiangyan, which we work with the team of Han Dongqing,professor at Southeast University, is very comprehensive and all aspects are discussed. Therefore, it is very difficult for us to define what exactly urban design should do or what concept to use. Everyone isexploring thisissue. Some people say that urban design should be exampled. Urban design is now too messy, at least from the market perspective is not good management.How charges and how unified standards? After the policy makers get the urban design, how to judge whether it is a qualified product? Everyone feels annoyed. But on the other hand, if the urban design is regulated, can it solve the problem? If the urban design is legalized,is the relationship with the existing statutory plan overlapping, complementary or alternative? When this question is not clear, it should not be regulated strictly.Personally, I think urban design should still be free to play its role in research and exploration.Our current statutory system has been covered comprehensivelyand it is far less legally necessary to make a statutory provision.We just need to supple the lack of statutory planning to expand the research perspective.Therefore, the “non-architectural” and “non-landscape” “non-planning” is the enrichment and integration of traditional architecture, landscape and planning.It is from the edge of different disciplines looking back and forth at our subject and exploring the definition of the urban design and the scope of our research. From this perspective, urban design is a good carrier.

Q2 Chengdu is a distinctive city. Could you please talk about the urban characteristics of Chengdu and Chengdu’s public space?

另一个可以对照的例子我觉得就是少城。少城那一片是因为宽窄巷子声名大振。它的骨架其实是北京的胡同，但是很大范围内的胡同和院落几乎都没有了。民国时期打开了胡同变成开放的街道，七八十年代新建的住宅楼替代了院落，但居民楼底层商业开放出来。正是由于历次的改变和建设的叠加，形成了少城独特的开放式均质街区，这种独特的街区在很长的时间内孕育出了各种不同的特色区域。少城的生命力是民间自发的，它跟太古里一次性开发改建完全不同。少城是缓慢的自发生长，这种生命力是原住居民内生的动力，那些商铺的店主对自己的小店充满了热爱和情感，他们会精雕细刻，慢慢去做，自己做得很有意思。所以，整个少城是个慢慢孕育的过程，而且这种多样性和持续的更新是任何设计师都无法做到的。大家可以看到，少城其实是很慢的，我们就经常呼吁少城更新需要特别谨慎，最好保持原有的格局，就让这些居民和店家自己慢慢弄，这才是有生命力的，也是最有成都韵味的地方。

Actually, in the past, Chengdu did not have much public space. Most of the public activities were in the courtyard of their own residential area or on the street. In the past, public activities were playing mahjong in the street, drinking tea in teahouses.The development of Chengdu is also a gradual public processof the city. It has become an open, modern and international city. This process has taken place after the reform and opening up, especially in the past ten years.The public space in Chengdu that we now see is mainly divided into two parts: one is the traditional streets and alleys, such as Shao cheng and alleys of the Yulin and the compound courtyards in the northern half of the city, whereare traditional places for public activities and retain the old charm of Chengdu. There are also some modern space for public activities and commercial or cultural activities.Such as the streets and alleys we sort out the narrow alley: Kuaizhai Xiangzi,the creative communityin the eastern suburbs,the Tianfu Square with many large-scale cultural facilities new built, as well as the new city which made a lot of large-scale parks along the river or around the lake, where people are willing to run or bike here after dinner. Now everyone’s lifestyle has changed, the city has become more open, more public. The development of a city is a combination of commerce, culture and life. Some of these activities may take place in some traditional fields,but new spaces will carry some new activities. The needs of life allow us to make some public space,and because of the new forms our public space, it shapes people’s way of life.

For example, in the past, people like to wander in the streets, like good size streets. But you will find that young people nowadays do not have the same shopping ways as the older generation. They tend to do one thing intentionally in a particular region or commercial complex. This is a different demand for urban space in the Internet age. The fun brought by shopping was a myriad of unknown and accidental activities. Now we are going to search on the phone to find out where the interesting places are and where we can eat the tasty. Before we start,we will set the itinerary and then follow the planned route to go. This kind of modernmodal way will be greatly different from the past. This requires that our present space be more focused on the strengthening of the features. Make our space more relevant to our activities, to engage everyone and to accommodate those activities that we expect.Different from the previous linear arrangement of stores, people like to browse and find their favorite shops slowly. It should be noticed that people’s living conditions have changed.

At the same time, the way we travel has also changed. Although we often emphasize walking,we shouldn’tdesign the entire city for walking, in case of a low efficiency city. It should mean people have a certain desire to stroll after reaching their destination. We are always saying that we must make some space for everyone to walk. I was wondering why we should let everyone walk. Why should we let people walk instead of sitting there?There must be something suitable to attract people to visit. Therefore, we should not put the cart before the horse. The reason why a pedestrian city has a sense of intimacy is because of the exchanges and interactions brought about by walking. This gives us a good experience, not only a purpose-oriented shopping. It is the purpose of walking to promote exchanges and dialogue between people and things, people and space, person and person,not the walking itself. It is just a kind of mean or a way. From this point of view, walking space must have comfort size.

电励磁磁通切换电动机中，励磁绕组通过的是直流电，电枢绕组中交变的电流方向决定了电动机中的磁通方向，励磁绕组可以采用与电枢绕组串联的方式(在电流较大，电压较低情况下)，也可以采取并联的方式(在绕组匝数较多情况下)分别如图3(a)、图3(b)所示。串联方式中，励磁绕组也担负着滤波器的作用。

Nowadays, the younger generation is known as the aboriginal people in the Internet era and also grew up in the era of traffic prosperity. Their way of life is built on two foundations: Internet engagement and motor flow, which create a completely different understanding of urban space. Therefore, we should not overreact to changes in our traditional urban scale. This is, to a large extent, the imprint of the development because people’s living conditions have changed dramatically. What we need now is to preserve the traditional and valuable things, rather than to make the new things completely traditional. The city, the environment and the architecture all show the characteristics of the times. Designers need to understand life, especially the living conditions of young people.Thinking more about humanity, people’s needs, not just the design itself. The core issue we just mentioned is humanity. We have to study why everyone uses this and how we use it. It is more important to add new experience to protectthe old cityand make it more vitality. We should study the human activities and future of the new district. These two kinds of public space in Chengdu is a lot, which represent a multi-year gradual development of the city of Chengdu. Sometimes, when my friends come over, I will take them to see Taikoo Li, and then drive along Tianfu Avenue, which can summarize Chengdu changes over the past few decades.Chengdu’s urban space is relatively pleasant, the city scale also has time-space changes,. In general,it is a breathable city.

Q3 You has mentioned Tianfu Avenue in Chengdu, which is also the central axis of Chengdu. Please tell us your views about this axis.

控制系统通过测量烟丝密度，计算得到烟支重量，根据烟支重量情况调节平准盘高度实现对烟丝量的控制，并调节平准盘相位实现对紧头位置的调整，同时对超轻、超重、空松、结块等不合格烟支进行剔除，从而将烟支重量平均值和标准偏差控制在要求范围内。

LIU Gang·TALK about Chengdu City[Interviewee]LIU Gang

作为两套相并列的法律体系，在国际投资法和文化遗产法两者产生矛盾后，可以考虑通过借鉴国际贸易法的理论视角和规制模式，选择不同的模式解决问题。

The reason why Chengdu develops along this axis may also have a psychological understanding. GeographicallyChengdu is caught between two mountains, on the one side is the Longmen Mountain, and while on the other side is Longquan Mountain. In that case, Chengdu Plain isa vertical basin sandwiched between mountains, and it seems like Chengdu can onlydevelopedin north-south direction. This understanding is gradually formed caused by the geographical and historical reasons,however for the cities; there is a great convenience of the axial development. It’s that the development of urban infrastructure and the description of urban narratives will be relatively simple. All the characteristic spaces and the image logo hangs on this axis, in that way it becoming quite simple and clear for everyone’s cognition of this city. It is hard to say what its benefits or disadvantages are, but it is one of the most important features of this city.

按以上程序代码将坐标点转换的程序语句输出到粘贴板。如图7所示，分别选取图中的1，2两点，对应的程序语句如图中信息提示，将坐标信息粘贴到文本编辑器中并添加准备功能字等便可以形成数控程序。

There is also an important change now that the administrative scope of Chengdu now extends to the huge area of the New Airport Metro which is at east of Longquanshan. So that the Longquan Mountain has become an ecological area sandwiched inside the city inside of the edge city area,and the pattern of the city may be greatly changed,as well as the path of urban development may also be changed, which is worth serious consideration and expectation.

Q4 Jinjiang is the mother river of Chengdu. When you talked about the public space in Chengdu, you also mentioned the parks along the Jinjiang River.How do you think of these waterfront spaces?

Jinjiang is the main river for irrigation in Chengdu Plain. The “Tianfu Greenway”recently mentioned is actually the 300-mile eco-belt along Jinjiang River. It sways southeast from Dujiangyan, encircling the Old City of Chengdu with the two rivers and then flows south all the way to Huanglongxi Ancient Town. Jinjiang is not only the bloodline of the millennium development in Chengdu but also the bond of history and culture.

Chengdu is like many cities, the water levels are not stable as well as the water networks are not as dense as Suzhou, and intimate feeling with water is not very satisfying. Therefore, what is more important is the waterfront space on both sides of the Taiwan Strait. Such a ribbon-shaped space is a carrier for public life and can well connect urban functions and ecological landscapes.The project to govern Nanan River in 1998 also won the UN Habitat Prize, changing the dirty and messy environment on both sides of the river and making some ecological demonstration projects like Living Water Park. After such projects, the city’s waterfront become clean and tidy, but still there exists several problems. There was a lot of waterfront space at that time planned for residential land, which resulted there is not enough publicity to connect the waterfront with public activities in a long period of waterfront space. This is the part that later giving rise to our reflection.And now it is gradually improving so that the entire Fu River and the areas around Nan River will become more public so that everyone can participate in it.

During this period, many small parks and greenways were built. In fact, people love to gather at the water’s edge and the urban waterfront space is extremely important to citizen. Of course, the cognition of this space is constantly changing with the development of the times. Because everyone has different ways of using it, and the life style of young people and elderly people are not the same.So, as we said earlier, it depends on what everyone’s life is like. And the experience of space and places will be different from before. We talk about that these waterfront spaces should become systematic and be connected which is based on a more important cognition. Waterfront space is not only a place for relaxing landscapes, but also a carrier of urban public life, a space for living and interaction,and a picture of urban vitality.

Q5 What do you think of the characteristics of Chengdu residents lifestyle?

In fact, I think the Chinese are quite similar, we chat, eat, and then have tea, play mahjong, and such activities like those may be about the same. Only becauseit’s kind of more famous Chengdu people playing mahjong than others, and it seems to feel that the whole city is playing mahjong. In fact, is not the case, especially now young people rarely play that and I’m kind of worried the mahjong may be lost (laughs). The life scene is changing rapidlyduring these years, and the changes in life brought by the Internet and electronic devices have really affected people more rapidly than before. Just like the two basics of Internet communication and modern transportation, as we mentioned above, the present state of life has changed a lot from the past.However, the unique leisure atmosphere and casual life attitude of Chengdu still inherit. This is the biggest feature of Chengdu, struggling hard while maintaining optimism.

Q6 You mentioned that Chengdu is a very inclusive city. What is the impact of migrants on Chengdu’s urban development and traditional characteristics?

精密称取同一批已知含量的六棱菊药材粉末（含量为 0.782 3 mg／g），共 9 份，分成 3 组，即低、中、高加样组（0.5 g药材含量的80%、100%和120%加样，加样量分别为 0.312 0、0.391 5、0.469 5 mg），六棱菊低、中、高加样组的橙皮苷的平均回收率分别为99.60%、99.97%、99.01%，RSD 分别为 2.78%、2.08%、1.36%（n＝3），表明该方法准确性良好（表 2）。

该系统与各个水源监测点组成一个网络互动工作平台，监控中心可实时监视水厂及水厂各个数据监测点的数据采集终端（RTU或PLC）运行情况、水源安全状况，并对水厂各个数据监测点所采集的电压、电流、电量、流量、流速、频率、转速、压力、水位、浊度、余氯等各种数据进行分析存储，供控制中心及有关部门分析和决策取用，提高管理工作效率。特点有以下几点：

As the first batch of famous historical and cultural cities in China, the number of material heritage is much less and the quality is so satisfyingcomparing to the other historical cities. However, Chengdu has not changed its city site for the whole 2,000-year,its city name has not changed and its entire city center has not moved. This inheritanceshould be a very important reason why Chengdu was selected at that time, and the inheritance is more of the pattern level and the consciousness level. Historically,the Chengdu Plain has undergone many major clean-ups and large-scale immigration. In that reason Chengdu does not have a strong timeline of history and it doesn’t be burdened by a sense of history as heavy as that of Rome and Xi’an. From our understanding Chengdu is particularly tolerant.A large part of Chengdu’s culture is closely linked with the civil culture and the community daily life.It is neither like Beijing’s historical accumulation based on royal aristocrats nor Xian’sdynastic plot and orthodoxy. The Broad and Narrow Alleyand A Small Cityleft in Chengduhave now become part of the civil culture, and a part connecting with life.

Therefore, Chengdu not only owns both of historical pattern and cultural heritage, but also both of inclusiveness and vitality as the immigrants city.Ifthere is anything we need to stick to, it must be the calm state of life, generous humanistic temperament, which isessence culture of Chengdu. In that reason, the preservation and inheritance of historical relics in Chengdu are not the same as those in other capital cities. Instead of being so thick and heavy, it is more of a relaxed and harmonious feeling.

相关部门要结合实际工作要求通过多渠道开展动物防疫检疫工作宣传，拟定规范化检疫标准，选取相应的检疫方式。通过有效的宣传能够明确防疫检疫工作标准，分析行业发展基本要求，对基层农户养殖活动进行有效引导。相关部门要定期对各类流行病进行调查，收集获取相关数据，整定疫情报告。相关部门需要对各类非法出售病死畜禽以及违禁药物的人员进行惩处。还需要强化动物防疫网络设立，相关技术人员要深入基层对广大养殖户的防疫检疫技术进行引导。

Q7 Could you please cite a case of the most unique public places in Chengdu?

There is a lot, but if you want me to give just one example, I have to say it’s hard. But I can cite two examples in contrast.

One is the IFS and the Taikoo-Li Area. That area is very interesting andit is a traditional area with Daci Temple and Chunxi Road, a traditional commercial district, while at the same time it blends modern things. You can see how Chengdubuilds a modern city commercial district in a traditional place. It is also very rare across the country to promote such a modern business around such cultural protection units as Daci Temple. In the past, we were all very nervous and cautious about the projects in those historical areas and it is easy to make all of the new buildings in the completely antique style. Taikoo Li is a good example for that. In fact, many scholars think this is correct that you cannot do it right if you built a fake antique next to the original part.We cannot promote the projectnear the historical district like some of the ancient cities, with superb antique old technology so that professional architects are hard to distinguish between true and false.That will instead dilute the value of the historical relics. The main point is to maintaining the pattern and continuing context, and meanwhile it’s best that we coulddistinguishold and new in a glance.In this way the temperament of the era will be integrated into the historical area, and the old city could renewal more content of life.

Another example I’d like to promote is A Small City, which is becoming more and more famous after the success of The Broad and Narrow Alley.Its streets structure actually is coming from Beijing’s alley, Hutong, but there is almost no alley and courtyard in a large area of it. During The Republic of China, the alley was opened into an open street, and then the new residential building in the 70s and 80s replaced the original courtyard,but the ground floor is freed and open as commercial function. It is precisely because of the previous changes and the superposition of the construction,the open and homogeneous blocks structure have been formed as the unique feature of A Small City.This unique neighborhood gave birth to a variety of zones with different characteristics during a long period. The vitality of A Small City is spontaneous from the citizen, which is totally different from the one-time construction and of Tai Koo Li.Small city is of a slow spontaneous growth, and this vitality is endogenous and from the motivation of aboriginal life. Those shops owner is full of love and emotionof their own shop, they will carvetheir shop as a piece of art, do it slowly, do it Interestingby themselves. Therefore, the development of the entire A Small City is a slowly inoculation process, and its diversity and continuous update cannot be done by any designer. We could figure out that the city is actually very slow.In that reasonwe often call for the city need to be updated with special care.It is better to keep the original pattern and allow these residents and shops to slowly develop by themselves.This is what we call “vitality”, which is also the most flavorful part of Chengdu.